I would argue Feudal is largely an objectively worse government form, if for no other reason than Dissolution factions are banned, and Independence factions are incredibly uncommon. Moreover, your vassal limit is way higher, so it's arguably the intended end-game, paint-the-map government.

The only real reason to switch to Feudal is personal preference. Administrative could potentially be considered by some to be more micromanagement. For example, to use all those extra MAAs, you have to individually request them from vassals, and you have to manually manage Appointment score for your family members.

I could reasonably see someone preferring Feudal for those reasons, but it's simply a worse government form in the objective sense.

As Razorblade said, the only downside to using Administrative is the micromanagement required to stay in power and ensure that your heirs inherit your land, rather than someone else. As for MAA, Administrative is better when you're not in a civil war, because you lose all the MAA of the governors in the civil war, and other governors can force other governors into factions, which can quickly get out of control. The only thing I don’t like about Administrative is the Appointment score. You only get a notification in the sidebar, so if you’re not paying attention, you could lose all your land to some nobody.

You can change the message settings to get a pop up for appointment score, but I think you get a pop up for all appointment heir changes, not just your own.

I think the lack of independence factions is too powerful. If you can break the cycle of constant rebellions, then you're pretty much unstoppable, especially with all the neat court items Byzantium gets.

I am loving administrative so I won't bother moving to feudal any time soon. All those MAAs without the cost of maintenance. I can see how civil war could become a big problem though if those ranks turn.

Thanks everyone for their contributions.

I painted the whole map using Feudal Government.
Not because I didn't like Administrative, but simply because it was too new for me to get in to yet. I feel like it's a lot more complicated playing in an administrative government compared to a feudal one

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Lera:

I painted the whole map using Feudal Government.
Not because I didn't like Administrative, but simply because it was too new for me to get in to yet. I feel like it's a lot more complicated playing in an administrative government compared to a feudal one

It's not

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Richard:

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Lera:

I painted the whole map using Feudal Government.
Not because I didn't like Administrative, but simply because it was too new for me to get in to yet. I feel like it's a lot more complicated playing in an administrative government compared to a feudal one

It's not

The micromanaging alone of who's inheriting what and all the political schemes are clearly a sign that it is

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Lera:

I painted the whole map using Feudal Government.
Not because I didn't like Administrative, but simply because it was too new for me to get in to yet. I feel like it's a lot more complicated playing in an administrative government compared to a feudal one

Your main hurdle'd be the lag playing admin for any extended period of time seems to cause not the complexity of the system. Not that a feudal world conquest wouldn't get laggy but I was playing until the 1300s, starting as early as possible, pre-admin with a bit of lag, now I struggle to get to 1100 before I find it's getting unplayable.

Well they have added a few more things to feudal, which already had the most content.

I have played feudal rulers recently and they are the same but wit a few measure to keep them up to snuff.

One thing I like, is they aren't trying to make a gov distinctively superior, rather another way of approaching game-play.

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από zè libereso:

Is there ever a time to do it? I love the new government after learning it. With access to so many MAAs, is there the need any longer to go feudal?

Is there a feudal version of administrative? What does the mid-game look like?

For pure warrior societies, Feudal is still vastly superior. There are multiple reasons, but the main one is: knights.

MAA are important, but more important is the fact, that you can only support as many MAA as you have counties. Unstations "excess" MAA are vastly inferior in quality and are not any better than mercenaries. That's why there is a natural "limit" to admin power growth.

Warrior societies on the other hand focus on knights, which are arguably always either very powerful, or downright broken. Hyperboosted knights deal such incredible amounts of damage. Just put it into perspective: A knight with 30 prowess (low end for a mid-late game warrior culture), does 3000 damage. This is roughly as much as a unit of armored footmen. Warrior cultures usually have tons of knight effectiveness though. 300 % is basic, 500-700 % about what you should be able to get if you build your culture for that purpose. So a single knight will do, if we take 500 %, 15 000 dmg, which equals 500 armored footmen. In mid-late game, having a steady supply of knights with 40-50 prowess is absolutely not a problem with feudal, because compared to admin government, noble familities that hold land have exceptional growth potential. They have more predictable successions and therefore are capable of building up quite a substantial armoury over the years, with blue and purple gear, giving you in the end dukes, that surpass even 60 and 70 prowess.

Admin might be better at preserving the power of the titles, but feudal does a better job at preserving the power of the noble families ruling over those titles. Because those knights are absolute powerhouses, that carry the fights even harder than any excess MAA could, warrior societies are better off with feudal than with admin. Adming is arguably better with every other culture and lifestyle type though.

So it sounds to me like I should considering transitioning to feudal mid-game. I was wondering why I haven't cleared more than 7-8 knights compared to my typical warrior pagan playthroughs.

Thank you!

Don't forget you can get the MAAs of the vassals in admin governments. 30k MAA, highest quality army? No big deal after you solidified the realm.

Administrative is just superior in all account. It adds so much stability to the realm, especially when ruler dies and heir comes in. You can just freely depose any vassals that are trying to make factions against you without incurring tyranny. While influencing your heir to have proper titles after you die takes like 1 minute. Not to mention that you can command your vassals to convert counties to your religion or culture.

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Pumis:

Not to mention that you can command your vassals to convert counties to your religion or culture.

You can do that without being admin. I've been doing it in a feudal Iberian run and before that did it in a clan Persian one (Iberia to finish the struggle and as Persia in India to get elephants).

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από brownacs:

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Pumis:

Not to mention that you can command your vassals to convert counties to your religion or culture.

You can do that without being admin. I've been doing it in a feudal Iberian run and before that did it in a clan Persian one (Iberia to finish the struggle and as Persia in India to get elephants).

I haven't noticed that. Oh well, still administration is superior. The fact that change in power is easily managed compared to feudal is biggest reason for that. That is infact the hardest part of the entire game.